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Hello and welcome to this website designers Web Designer Lexington video tutorial.

I’m Owen Corso from Google.

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And today, we’re going to build a rich media expandable creative with video.

Let’s start by selecting file, New File.

This opens a dialog box where we will set up our ad.

First, let’s make out high of project.

We have four options– The default is Display & Video 360so we will leave that as is.

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LYNN MERCIER: Thetruth is, like, if we want to evolve thematerial design system, we need to be able tobuild on top of the code, and each layer ofthat code matters.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU:The conveyor belt is-- designer works onsomething, developer takes it, and developer screams becausethere was no conversation.

I think that's one ofthe biggest challenges.

[MUSIC PLAYING] One of the challenges inthe beginning with material on the web was there's so manydifferent implementations.

Again, the singlesource of of truth, so you had Angular material,you had Polymer, you had MDL.

How have you found solvingthat single source of truth? LYNN MERCIER: Yeah.

Originally we had a unique teamof developers in both Android-- I'm sorry-- Angular,and Polymer, and all these otherweb frameworks sort of building their ownimplementations in material design.

But we found that we couldn'tkeep that going at scale.

Like, we were iterating onthe material design system so quickly, and we couldn'tkeep a single source of truth with these othercomponent libraries.

So we started developinga technology where we would write our JavaScriptonce and sort of abstract its interaction with theHTML, so you wouldn't directly reference a DOM element.

And then we wouldwrap that JavaScript in individualcomponent libraries.

It's not a perfect solution.

We're still working onmaking it faster and better, but we've foundthat that creates these sort of componentsthat look like they belong in the framework.

So any framework developerwho's working there, they look seamlesslylike they're a part of the environment.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU: The onething that we struggled with with MaterialDesign Lite was there was a lot of blackmagic going on in the DOM.

So you check DeveloperTools, and there'll be, like, these random elements.

And that was, like, anopinionated decision so, you know, how do you go aboutdeveloping a new framework where you have to have anopinion-- there has to be, like, this is the baselineof what we're doing-- without impeding on, like, whatthe developer just wants to do? They just want this componentto work, or this widget, or whatever.

LYNN MERCIER: Yeah.

I try as much as possibleto avoid black magic.

And, like, whenever I'mreviewing any code that any of the designers on myteam are writing, we, like, try and avoid anything that's-- maybe it's a little hack,and it makes it slightly more performant-- butthe truth is, like, if we want to evolve thematerial design system, we need to be able tobuild on top of the code, and each layer ofthat code matters.

So we try and, like, steeraway from any black magic and just have thisone source of truth that works with all thecomponent libraries as much as possible.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU:In terms of, like, working withexisting frameworks, what's the relationship there? Because, like, React isa thing-- you have to-- it's the real world, right? LYNN MERCIER: Mm-hmm.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU: Or likeWordPress is a thing.

Like, you have towork in that world.

LYNN MERCIER: Mm-hmm.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU: So theremay be certain things that you can or can'tdo as a result of that.

LYNN MERCIER: Yeah.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU: Like, formaintaining a framework where-- it's not Android.

It's not, like, a single-- LYNN MERCIER: Yeah.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU:--you have-- it's, like, the web is allabout relationships between different code bits.

I mean, how do you manage that? LYNN MERCIER: It gets reallytricky and really funny.

So we tend to prioritizethem in terms of what developers are already using.

So React is a great example.

There are a ton of codebases already in React-- it's super-popular.

So we want to prioritizethat one first, which is why we're making anMDC React library for React in particular.

But then there'sother libraries, like Angular andlike Polymer that we want to start using as well.

But we tend toprioritize them, again, based off whether or notdevelopers are already using them.

In terms of, like, keepingall that functioning-- and sometimes you endup, like, one framework wants it to do it oneway and another framework wants it to do another way.

It's just constantlycompromising.

Like, we work with thesedevelopers on the Polymer team, or we, like, talk tothe React community and try and figure out what'sthe right way to figure it out.

And we just sort of settleon the right compromise and stay there.

We do it as well with browsers.

So for example, we tendto develop first on Chrome because it's kind of thebest, and it works nice, but we have to support Safari,and Firefox, and Edge as well.

So we tend to testIE at the very end.

And we want it towork, but there's sort of, like, gracefuldegradation sort of things that happen.

As long as that happens, like,carefully and gracefully, then it tends to be OK.

And I think we do the samesort of thing with platforms.

You know, maybe itdoesn't perfectly work in everyplatform but as long as we can kind ofgracefully degrade that component in thatsituation, it'll work out.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU: Yeah, Iknow the BBC have, like, a term that's calledcutting the mustard.

So basically, they willhave, like, a baseline where things have to work.

LYNN MERCIER: Yeah.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU: Like, withthis, and if it doesn't work, or it doesn't supportthis technology, they're gonna say--you know what, you're not going to getthese experiences that we're designing.

I mean it-- how would youfeel about that as a concept? LYNN MERCIER: Yeah, we'vehad to use that already.

So there's newthings coming out-- material designed around shape.

And on the web platform,no matter what technology you're in-- like, what webplatform or what browser you're in-- rounded corners are really easy.

Like, cut-off corners? Impossible.

Just straight up impossiblewith the existing technology.

And so we kind of had to goback to our material design team and say, like-- look, we can update theCSS spec today in 2018, and then three years fromnow, our children's children will, like, have thisfeature, but we're not going to be able toimplement it right now.

So there are some featureswhere you just kind of have to draw the line and say,we can't do this feature without it beinga confusing story, without it being some sortof hack that no one would be able to use.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU:So how about SVG? I mean, I suppose whenit comes to animation, the challenge of SVG isthe performance 'cause-- LYNN MERCIER: SVGs, and thenthe shadows on top of them, and the scroll performanceunderneath those SVGs-- by the time you, like, transportall the browsers and all the situations wherethat component would be, it gets reallyconfusing quickly.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU:And very complicated.

LYNN MERCIER: Yeah,very complicated.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU: That'squite interesting, because the conveyor belt isdesigner works on something, developer takes it, anddeveloper screams because there was no conversation.

I think that's one of thebiggest challenges developers face because, ifyou just talk to me, then I'll be able to explain,especially for designers who have no coding experience.

And I know we've spokenbefore, and you've mentioned stress testingthe design, which is a new concept for me.

LYNN MERCIER: It's my concept.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU: How doesthat work, where you're stress testing the design? LYNN MERCIER: Imean, I think there's a limitation inDesigner Tools that make them want to forceeverything to sort of this pixel-perfect mock.

And it's gorgeous-- itcreates some gorgeous assets, but it doesn't always workin a real-world application.

And a developer'sjob is to create something that works in areal-world application, right? Ours is the stuff-- thecode that's running live.

And so many problems come froma design being pixel-perfect for one language, one screenwidth, one set of content.

And when you goto build that, you can build sort of adummy site quickly, but once you start populatingit with real content, all these problems come up.

And I think most designers,if you go and talk to them and say, like-- hey,I have this problem.

They'll help you.

They'll, like, show youhow to change the design and tweak it in this situation.

Like, they're very receptiveto that feedback-- they want to make their designs better.

But if you don't knowwho your designer is when you have thisproblem, then you just have this bug that says-- doesn't work in German.

Like, what do you do? You have no idea how to fix it.

So yeah, I think this conveyorbelt problem of designers who sort of, like,design something but then leave the projectand don't collaborate with the developers asthey're building it, it makes it reallydifficult for the developers to make the productbetter over time.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU: So how do youthink designers can actually improve their process to makethat relationship better? Or more, is it reallydown to the most obvious? You just need to pairprogram, or pair together.

You have to talk to the person.

That's really the bestway to do it, so like-- LYNN MERCIER: Thatis the best way.

I mean, I think that can bereally difficult in certain-- if you don't have enoughtime and resources, sort of dedicate, like, one person,one designer, and one developer to every single feature.

I think there's waysin the middle to do it.

So for one, make sure thatyou know each other's names.

Like, if you'reremote, make sure you know how to deployyour code somewhere to staging so yourdesigner can work with it, and make sure your designerhas a way to send you, like, iterations on mocks.

Another sort of quick andobvious thing, I think, for designers is tointernationalize.

The moment you take allthe text from your mock, put it in Google Translate,put it back in the mock, and see what looks horrible-- MUSTAFA KURTULDU: German.

LYNN MERCIER: --like, yeah! German! Or even, like, CJK languages.

Just pick a language.

It doesn't matter ifyou translate it right.

Just, like, do thatfirst step because you're going to run into all thewidth and height problems that a developerwill run into live.

And I think it's goodfor designers, right? It helps you makeyour product better to get feedback aboutwhat sort of languages do I need to support.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU:And it's especially important inuser-generated apps where the content could be 10 pages,or it could be two lines.

LYNN MERCIER: Yeah! MUSTAFA KURTULDU:It's not like-- you always get the mock wherethere's, like, the name-- LYNN MERCIER: Yeah! MUSTAFA KURTULDU: --theavatar name's perfect.

LYNN MERCIER: Fits perfectly.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU: Yeah, butwhat if the name's like, you know, four words long? LYNN MERCIER: Yeah.

MUSTAFA KURTULDU: Isthere anything else that they can do like the stresstest that wasn't just really-- LYNN MERCIER:Internationalization is a big one.

I think different screen widths,at least in your own web, is helpful as well,like making sure that the obviousbreakpoints work but also sort of smallerones or bigger ones.

But, yeah, it justcomes back to, like, be there when your developerruns into a real problem and help them fix that problem.

I think most developerswant to fix problems.

They want to code that out.

They just want to geton their headphones-- like, get the code outthat will fix the problem, but they don't know how toredesign the site, right? We're not going to-- ifyou make a developer guess how to design a site, we'regoing to guess really poorly.

So you need to helpus as designers.

SPEAKER: If you spentloads of time polishing your, like, amazingprototype, then you suddenly becomevery, like, you know, reticent to throw it away.

Kind of like it'syour baby, you're going to polish this too much.

And so that's dangerous,because then you're not using prototyping forprototyping's real purpose, which is to learn.

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Next, we can select the type of ad.

We want to make an expandable, so we select Expandable on the left.

Next, we can set again ad’s dimensions.

We are building a 320 by 50that expands to 480 by 250.

So I will make those changes.

We then assign the Lexington creative a name.

I will leave my Save ToLocation as the default, and leave the talk about set to Quick.

Once I’m happy with my settings, I click OK.

Google Web Designer creates the initial pages of the ad for me with the dimensions I defined.

 

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The collapsed page already contains a Tap Area event to expand the ad and an expanded pageLexington with a close tap area to collapse back down.

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KENT: My name is Kent.

I'm the creativespecialist on the Google Web Designer team and I'd like to review dynamic exits in Studio A dynamic exit refers to the URL loaded when a dynamic ad is clicked on It's usually related to the product being shown and that URL comes from yourdata feed This video describes the workflow for setting up dynamic exits in Studio Now the simplest case is an ad which doesn't use a gallery or carouselcomponent Here's an example from another one of my videos titled Dynamic inStudio - Google Web Designer You'll see my creative contains only placeholder content But when I preview it in Studio you'll see it loading data from my feed Refresh it Now we're seeing product number 0 Look at my feed for product 0 we're seeing this name, this image and here is the URLfor my exit for this product Now when I set up this ad, I used the simple static exit So when I click anywhere on the ad it'll load a static URL like a landingpage What we want to have happen is this to exit to the URL associated for that product Let me show you how to do that in Google Web Designer First thing we'll do is select the current event and delete it Then we're going to look over inour components panel and open up Interaction and grab a taparea Then with the Transform control selected I'm going to stretch this out to cover the ad And in my Dynamic panel I'm going to click the plus icon to make a new binding We'll select that tap area We're going to look for Exit override URL And we'regoing to drill into our feed the first item, exit URL, and get the URL Click OK and we'llpublish this Now when that's done we'll switch over toStudio We'll reload our creative I'm going to click on the ad Now I'll see we'regetting product one Just to make sure this is really working let's reload itand get another image Here's number five Let's click on that Here's product fiveso that's good Now next thing you might want to do is combine static and dynamicexits in a single ad so you might want to have a logo up here which goes to a home page and maybe some disclaimer text down here which goes to a legal page So let's see how we can do that Back in Google Web Designer I'm going to double click this newtaparea and give it a new name exit-default then I'll copy and paste it I'm going to call that one exit-product and this layer is on top So I'm going tomake this just cover the product area and I'm going to select exit-default andchange the exit on that Now one trick over here in the Dynamic panel I can choose Selection and now I would just see the binding on that selection I'm going to select it and delete it With it still selected I'm going to move to the Events panel click the plus icon and add a new event Google ad, exit ad, gwd-ad I'm going to put an arbitrary ID in here and I'm going to put a full URL to mylanding page OK and we're going to publish again Now when that's done, we'll switch back to Studio and reload the page Now when I click in the corners I'm getting my static URL And when I click on the product I'm getting the correct product That concludes this demo, dynamic exits in Studio Thanks for watching.

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I’m no color expert. Far from, actually. Throughout my career, I’ve depended on visual designers better than myself to produce an engaging palette and apply it harmoniously across a UI.

Yet, as a systems designer, I’m often in the position to provoke and validate color decisions as a system takes shape. Here’s a 16 lessons I’ve learned while stabilizing a primary palette, tint and shade choices, secondary palettes, and solving for accessible contrast.

Primary Palette

By primary, we’re talking colors used everywhere including your brand colors, neutrals, and a typically interactive digital blue.

#1. Stabilize Brand Colors Quickly

︎Every organization has one, two, or no more than a few core brand colors. THE red. THE blue. THE orange. Settle on them. Even if reasonably set up with a color variable or two, nothing signals a design system team that can’t get their act together than constantly changing primary colors.

Takeaway: Decide your essential brand colors early, because they spread widely, quickly.

#2. Involve Brand (If You Alter a Brand Color)

Is brand blue a bit dull? Can’t resist the urge to liven it up? Nothing poisons early collaboration more than a casual “We saturated the brand orange for web” followed by brand reacting with “You did what?” Oh the sacrilege!

Takeaway: Brand colors are the brand team’s territory. So discuss adjustments with them and defer to their judgment as needed.

#3. Drop the Neutral Neutrals

From dark-as-night charcoal to fluffy light gray, neutrals provide essential UI scaffolding. Loading a system with neutrals, even a few, risks giving teams access to muddy colors. They can also lead to “wireframey” designs. And, neither dark nor light type has sufficiently accessible contrast on a medium gray background.

Takeaway: Provide a few light grays and a few dark grays to achieve useful contrast, but don’t get wishy washy wireframey. Consider avoiding medium grays in between.

#4. Go “Digital Blue.” Everybody Else Does.

My past five design systems settled on a saturated blue as a default button and link color. Links have always been blue, perhaps since the dawn of the first browser. This “Digital” blue, a utility color for links and clickable items, is essential in any core palette.

Takeaway: When (not if 😉 ) you go with your “Digital Blue,” choose an accessible one and make sure it doesn’t clash with the brand’s own blue, or red, orange, purple, or green.

Tints & Shades Per Color

You can’t have just a few colors and call it a day, right? System users often need to tune a color choice across a range, reuse with ease, and know their boundaries.

#5. Stack the Tint & Shade Range, Per Color

Color palette display patterns long predate the web. Yet I still love me a compactly arranged tint stack. They can be just…gorgeous. The best stacks visualize more than just a color, combining its name with HEX codes, code variables, and other indicators (such as prohibiting overlaid type). A quick scan is all you need.

Takeaway: Stack available colors in each hue, and treat the stack as a visualization to include important details compactly.

Material Design’s Indigo and Deep Orange

#6. Name Tints & Shades by Brightness

We’ve all been there. A month into the system, the neutrals $color-gray-1, $color-gray-2, … , $color-gray-7 — are stable. And then, in a stroke, you’ve got another tint to add stuck between -1 and -2. That numbering system stinks.

Takeaway: Scale color names between 0 and 100 based on brightness, such as $color-gray-05 and $color-gray-92. The scale reflects a familiar range from dark to light, allows for injecting new options between, and heck if I won’t remember $color-gray- 93 until we retire it later.

#7. Limit Tint & Shade Quantity

At the core of a good system is choice without endless options, a stable aesthetic to serve as a starting point. Odds are, you aren’t Material Design, intended to serve countless products. In most cases, a design system need not offer boundless choices. The more choices you provide, the tougher it’ll be to control harmonic combinations and a consistent feel across applications.

Takeaway: Offer a handful of options and avoid tedious variety. Empower system users with just enough choice: more than a single option, but only up to a few intentional choices.

#8. Tell Me How To Transform: Hand-Pick or Functionally

Modern tools like SASS and Stylus offer transformation functions like darken and lighten to shift a color by a brightness percentage. These handy tools enable a you to alter a color for subtle contrasts like a hovered button or tiered navigation.

But transforms can be troublesome: carefully crafted base colors can become inaccessible alternatives (see below), a page’s overall palette can muddy, or a “5% system” that works on moderately bright colors yields insufficient contrast for a very light or dark case.

Takeaway: Deliberately allow — or avoid — color transformations in your system. If you endorse the practice, then offer examples of when and how to do it effectively in your system, such as 5–10% for moderately bright cases and 10–20% in more extreme cases. If transformations should be avoided , document that succinctly.

Secondary Palettes

Beyond the brand colors and their variants, well-considered color systems array the broader variety of colors reserved for varied purposes.

#9. Define Meaningful Sets Like Feedback Colors

Most systems reserve a certain red for errors, green for success, yellow for warning, and (possibly a lighter sky) blue for informational messages. Feedback color is critical, because it’s positioned at the top of the page interacting with other key components and/or encountered as a result of an unwelcome circumstance. Without system guidance, such messages become embedded in product code, the result of product teams solving a challenge quickly and moving on.

Takeaway: Explore and define the standard feedback colors and other relevant sets to ensure that colors fit harmoniously rather wedging them in later or having teammates recall “I just grabbed it from Google.”

Typical feedback colors: success, warning, error and informational

#10. Illustrate Theme Variety

In some systems, color use is customized per product, section, or brand. Often, this may be a result of relating a master brand (think, Marriott International) to its sub-brands (think Courtyard Hotels, Ritz Carlton, and Moxy Hotels). Or it’s a prefab themes like Ambient Warmth and Frozen Blue. Maybe the user is complete control, and you need to illustrate the breadth of (all the havoc of) what they can do.

Takeaway: Reveal the range of themes available compactly, and set boundaries around allowable theme colors in certain contexts.

Theme colors for multiple Marriott.com hotels, derived from product pages

#11. Define How Theming Works

It’s not enough to simply say “Go ahead and theme it!” A theme color may apply to predictable accents throughout a UI such as button background-color, active tab background-color, or a primary navigation’s thick border-top. Just as important, theme colors may be forbidden from altering other bits, such as long form type or — yikes! — a link color that ends up invisible.

Takeaway: Identify how theming works, particularly via reference to specific UI element properties in play. Just as important, articulate which — if not most — elements are off limits.

#12. Avoid Guiding on Color-Mixing Until (At Least) Dust Settles

One of my favorite all time design system tools is Google’s MDL Color Customizer, which enables users to combine primary and secondary UI colors effectively. It’s so easy, and the outcome so helpful. Yet, the system teams I work with either don’t want to provide this kind of flexibility or lack the time and care necessary to solve such a combinatoric challenge.

Takeaway: Avoid the rabbit hole of solving for a vast array of color combinations unless it’s a core system value. In most cases, system users will pair up their own combinations or benefit from a tool more dedicated to doing just that. Help them propagate their choice rather than solving for every combination they may consider. That experimentation is their job.

Serve users of your system by making it efficient to propagate their choice through a product, rather than making the choice for them.

Contrast & Accessibility

Solving for accessible color contrast should a core practice of setting up any digital color system from the get go. However, design can be tumultuous place, and teams can lose sometimes. Or some members don’t know about accessibility. Or they simply don’t prioritize it.

A systems team can engrain accessible practices into a workflow to provoke and spread values in accessibility broadly across an enterprise.

#13. Check Contrast Early & Ritually

It happens often: a few weeks or days before a product — or design system — launch, finally somebody notices. The design team hasn’t taken necessary care to ensure the primary and secondary color palette is being applied in a way to meet WCAG 2.0 color contrast of 3.0 (for large, heavier type) or 4.5 (for standard type). So designers — and then, their developers — scramble to determine fixes and inject it into the code.

Takeaway: Any system designer responsible for color must be familiar with WCAG 2.0 rules, have a tool (like Tanaguru) to test color pairs, and incorporate the practice into color selection.

Tanaguru, one of many accessibility calculators online

#14. Explore Accessible Color Choices Across Ranges

A drawback of WCAG guidelines is its stark threshold: a color pair passes or fails. This leaves designers yearning for more, but worse leaves stakeholders flummoxed at how bad the color pair fails and how much it needs to change.

Conversation quickens when we reveal a spectrum of choices, with the pass/fail line fairly evident. This transforms the process from trial and error to tuning a dial. Before, it was “That pair failed. Let’s try again.” Now, it’s an enlightening “Oh, so that’s how dark the blue needs to be” followed by a rational discussion to balance visual tone, brand identity, and accessibility sensitivities.

Takeaway: When exploring accessible color contrast, show a range of choices to help a team select a color that passes the test.

Exploring neutral and interactive colors by showing multiple choices across a range

#15. Solve the Reverse Light on Dark and Dark on Light

When creating a system, it’s up to the systems designer to be mindful of and solve for the entire range of choices on offer. It’s not enough to just test for accessibility problems as they arise. Instead, a color palette should be thoroughly reviewed prior to publishing a system for reuse.

This is especially true for reverse color treatments. It’s very common for a system to default to dark text on a light background. However, most find themselves reversing color treatments, whether a black and white on light and dark neutrals or tints of another primary or secondary color.

Takeaway:Solve for and recommend reversed pairings to adopt or avoid.

A table of calculated contrast (using a SASS function) between neutral backgrounds and interactive blue alternatives

#16. Use Color to Provoke Broader Accessibility Awareness

Color is fundamental to a system, and accessible color contrast is fundamental to color. This injects accessibility smack dab into the middle of a system’s formation. People that matter are paying attention: brand managers, design leads, developers, and execs. What a wonderful opportunity to use color to open a door to the broader array of accessibility considerations.

Takeaway: Seize the opportunity to advocate for accessibility. Always be probing a collaborator’s knowledge of accessibility (or lack thereof) and educate and advocate all you can.

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ADRIENNE PORTERFELT: You've probably tried to buy somethingonline or had to fill out some formfor your kid's school, and it's reallyhard on your phone.

It's really hard.

MUSTAFA: There seemsto be a dark art when it comes to nativeapplications, and they're such small details thatyou're actually working on.

[MUSIC PLAYING] Quite often, developers willjust throw on input fields onto a page and not reallythink about the UX that's attributed to that.

So they'll think ofa flow of a form, but they won't necessarilyfeel that individual input, so how a user struggles.

And we know thatautocomplete really helps speed up theuser experience and makes fillingforms quite nice.

What are your feelingsand experiences on autocomplete andAutofill as a thing? ADRIENNE PORTER FELT:From the user experience, you've probably triedto buy something online or had to fill out someform for your kid's school.

And it's reallyhard on your phone.

It's really hard.

It's even hard on desktop.

You don't want to get upand get your credit card out of your purse,which is downstairs.

And these browserfeatures just really improve the userexperience of using a form.

In fact, we find that peoplefill out or submit the form 30% faster if the formworks with Autofill.

So we very much suggest thatweb developers think about this.

You want people to besubmitting your forms.

Right? So if you really want yourforms to be submitted quickly, easily, work with Autofill.

MUSTAFA: And why do you thinkdevelopers don't do that? Is it very difficult to do? I'm assuming it's just a fewattributes you add to inputs.

Right? ADRIENNE PORTER FELT: Yeah.

It's actually not that hard.

So you basically need to setup autocomplete attributes, and you need to makesure that you're not doing any fancy things thatreplace the normal select and input elements withother types of elements.

I think most of these developersjust don't think about it, don't realize,that you just need to put a littlebit of extra effort in to make sure that yourform works well with Autofill and to test it out.

MUSTAFA: Is that oneof the challenges, I suppose, like people makingthese custom UI things, which are not native but justlike divs or whatever and replacing that? Is that where thingsfall down with Autofill? ADRIENNE PORTER FELT:Honestly, there's a few things that can go wrong,but that's one of the big ones.

Yeah, so someone wants thisreally beautiful custom form where the dropdown isall fancy and custom.

And as a result of that,they're using all divs.

And the browser can'tfigure out, oh, this is supposed to be a form.

And then in that case,Autofill isn't going to work.

MUSTAFA: And Isuppose there's a lot of accessibilityissues connected to that as well, it looks like.

But from your pointof view, you've got designers anddevelopers, they want to do something custom,like unique experience.

But then as someone whoworks on the browser, you want to say, now letthe browser do the work.

Do you think there'sa middle point there? How can developers at leasthave a custom experience that's unique to theirproduct, but at the same time without breaking standards? Because this is one of thebiggest challenges on the web.

ADRIENNE PORTER FELT:So there's a lot of things you can do tochange the look of the form on the page while stillusing the select and input elements that HTML provides.

Right? You can customizethem in many ways.

I have to admit, there is onething you can't customize, and it's the lookof the dropdown, like in a select element.

But everything else, the wayit statically looks on a page, you can customize.

And the browser will stillknow that they're fields.

MUSTAFA: Yeah.

What you see is thebiggest challenge then, for Autofillor implementation, from your point of view? ADRIENNE PORTER FELT:I think it's honestly that developers don't thinkabout it, that people don't think to themselves that theyreally need to be testing their forms in this way.

When you've made it yourself,you've filled it out 100 times.

You tested it yourself.

And you don't thinkabout the fact that a user is goingto be coming to it in a different state of mind.

They're tired.

They are tryingto fill it out as fast as they can on the phone.

So I think developersjust aren't really thinking about the factthat they need to take these extra small steps.

MUSTAFA: So in terms ofbrowser compatibility, the things you're using willbe Chrome-specific stuff? Or is that open source-- not open source, butit's cross-platform.

ADRIENNE PORTER FELT: Yeah,that's a good question.

So specifically autocompleteattributes for Autofill, that's standardized.

All the browsers respect them.

With that being said, thereis one part, turning Autofill off-- that's the autocompleteoff attribute-- is not respected by all browsers.

But if you say,this form should be a credit card, thatwill be respected by all the major browsers.

MUSTAFA: But eachexperience, is there slight quirks per browser? Because obviously, that's goingto be a browser-specific thing.

ADRIENNE PORTER FELT: Some are-- they have veryslightly different UIs.

For example, maybe they'llbe integrated with a keyboard widget versus a dropdown.

But I think they're prettysimilar across browsers.

MUSTAFA: You work on theactual Chrome UI itself.

ADRIENNE PORTER FELT: Yes.

MUSTAFA: So are you actuallybuilding that design and code yourself, or are youworking with UX designers in that process? ADRIENNE PORTER FELT: Sowe have a design team.

And the design team helpsus figure out what those UI elements should look like.

We actually have a bigredesign coming up this year that I think is going tomake those substantially more beautiful and also help clean upthe code, which I know that it won't affect most people becauseit won't look any different.

But from our perspective-- MUSTAFA: It's much cleaner.

ADRIENNE PORTER FELT: Man,the code's so much cleaner.

MUSTAFA: What's the actualprocess of you actually creating UI? Because for me, I do front-enddevelopment and code.

But it's like there seemsto be a dark art when it comes to native applications.

And they're such smalldetails that you're actually working on, which the user maynot notice because it works.

But if it's broken,they will see it.

What is the actualprocess that you go through with your Chromedesigners to actually making the UI or testing it? I'm asking lots ofquestions all at once.

ADRIENNE PORTERFELT: Yeah, it's OK.

It's OK.

So I'll talk about theprocess a little bit.

So usually at the beginning,Product, Eng, and the designer will get togetherand talk about what they hope for from the feature.

Often, the designwill then come up with some conceptualmocks of what they feel the feature could look like.

They'll get feedbackfrom Product.

They'll get feedback fromthe engineers, like can we actually build this, whatare the corner cases we need? And then we'lliteratively get closer to what we actually can ship.

So I work on across-platform team, which means that whatwe build has to ship on all of Chrome's platforms.

People think of Chromeas one platform.

But actually, it'sWindows and Mac-- which previouslyhad different UIs, but we're coming toone single standard-- Android, iOS.

And so we have to havedifferent mocks that relate to the specific platforms.

So some things may bepossible for some subset.

Anyway, the designers get allthis feedback from engineers, like, we can do thishere and not there.

And then we iterativelycome through to red lines, which isour final set of designs.

And that's what we implement.

MUSTAFA: So in termsof do the designers work with the actual W3C? Because you'redesigning something which has to beconsidered cross-platform at the same [? time.

?] So likewhen the payment request API, like I was working withsome of the team there, there seems to be thingswhere you have to really be seeing whateveryone else is doing so that the experiencethat you're creating is not so widely different.

And that can be quitechallenging for the designer and developer because youinstinctively want to make it, I don't know, "better.

" But you don't want to makeit so vastly different, because then you stick out.

ADRIENNE PORTER FELT: That'san interesting question.

The challenge here isthat with specs, we try not to specify whatthe UI has to look like.

We try to talk about what theuser experience should be so that we can have the appropriatecallbacks, et cetera, to build that experience.

But we don't like tostandardize the UI itself, which is a fine balance becauseyou have to have a UI in mind when you're designing the API.

But we try to make itas general as possible so that we can build differentUI experiences on top of it.

MUSTAFA: Are you workingwith the browsers as well at the sametime to do that, or is it you do things independently? Because there's the thing.

It's like if you do it[INAUDIBLE] the browsers, then you may be leddown a path that's not the best for everyone.

That it's, OK, it'slike a compromise.

But at the same time, you don'twant that complete disparity.

ADRIENNE PORTER FELT: Itdepends a lot on the standard, honestly.

Some of them willbe heavily driven by Chrome or some other browser.

They really want this API.

They'll drive it, and thenget a little bit of feedback along the way fromother vendors.

Whereas others,from the beginning, there's severaldifferent browser vendors working together.

So honestly, it differsfrom standard to standard.

MUSTAFA: And we're coming to the10-year anniversary of Chrome.

What do you thinkthe future of say, Autofill, or just workingwith the other browsers? Because it seems like thingsare getting much better.

I was speaking toDarren, and it was like, the implementationof Flexbox was a nightmare becausethe standard kept changing.

But with CSS grid, it'samazing that there's so much cross-collaborationbetween the browsers, which is great for the users and thedevelopers working across this.

What do you think the futureis for Chrome as a platform and, I suppose, Autofillas well as a specific? ADRIENNE PORTER FELT: Sofor Autofill specifically, it's hard to saybecause I don't think the limitation there reallyis the lack of browser vendors cooperating.

I feel like actually, there'sbeen a lot of discussion, for example, aroundpayment request.

There's a lot of collaborationbetween Safari and Chrome.

I think that thereal problem we have is that Autofill dependson developer adoption.

Right? If it's hard for thebrowser to figure out what form's in thepage, we're not going to be able to Autofill it.

And so I think thething we really care about is whetherwe can get developers interested in andusing the tools that we have provided for them totry to improve the Autofill experience.

MUSTAFA: Yeah.

Do you ever have toremove a feature when you see there's not wide adoption? Because I can seefrom an engineer, you're working on Chrome.

You spent your heart andsoul working on this feature.

And then you know it'sgreat for user experience.

You know from theresearch that Autofill will help transactions,and it's just nicer.

But if adoption doesn'thappen, how do you [INAUDIBLE]?? It's the biggest-- ADRIENNE PORTER FELT: Yeah,that's a really hard one.

I've been througha few deprecations.

They can be really challenging.

It's very hard.

So there are a few waysyou can look at it.

One is how many usersinteract with websites that are using such a feature.

And obviously, thatnumber is large, you don't want to create apain point for a lot of users.

But even if thenumber is very small, it might be that there are afew websites, a few companies, whose entire businessmodel depends on having access to this API.

And so that can make itvery difficult, where OK, even if it's thisreally a niche thing, it still can behard to deprecate.

So I think there have beenlots of ongoing discussions in general about howto make that trade-off.

Some of the onesI've been involved in relate specificallyto security and TLS, where if something is makingthe web as a whole as safe, we may have to breaksome connections in order to deprecate it.

And it can be areally painful thing when you've got old serverson the internet that aren't being upgraded.

And maybe it's only a smallpercentage of overall page loads, but it'sstill frustrating when a user is trying to getto a website and it's broken.

MUSTAFA: Yeah.

But ultimately, fromChrome's perspective, it's the user's experiencethat's paramount.

Right? ADRIENNE PORTER FELT: Yes.

MUSTAFA: And theirsafety and security.

So it's like HTTPS, you couldprobably explain it better, but there's a cutoff pointwhere if your site is not loaded on HTTPS, you're goingto get a message saying, this isn't secure.

That's true.

Right? ADRIENNE PORTER FELT: Fora long time in Chrome, we showed HTTP as neutral, HTTPas just plain text and no TLS.

MUSTAFA: Sorry, what's TLS,just for my non-designer-- ADRIENNE PORTER FELT: Oh, TLSis the underlying protocol that makes HTTPS HTTPS.

It's why it's secure.

So there is HTTP,which doesn't have any of the end-to-endsecurity bits on it.

And HTTP websiteswere just shown as a neutral standard thing.

Right? Most websites on the web wereHTTP, but that's changed.

We went from a few yearsago, we were at 25% HTTPS.

And now, it's the opposite wherewe're at more like 75% HTTPS.

So made changes in theUI to back that up.

So now when you go to awebsite that says HTTP, it's going to also say"not secure" next to it so people reallyunderstand what that means.

MUSTAFA: That decision mustbe quite tough, though.

In some respects, you need toforce the developers to say users' security is paramount.

But at the sametime, does it feel like you're breaking the web? ADRIENNE PORTER FELT:It doesn't really feel like we'rebreaking the web.

First of all, Ithink people have seen this a long time coming.

We've been talking aboutit for a long time.

We've rolled it out in phases.

So first, we started showing"not secure" specifically for pages with passwordsand credit card form fields.

And then it was for allform fields and web pages when viewed in incognito.

And now we're rolling itout for all HTTP websites.

And as you can see, becauseHTTPS adoption has really increased, it's onlyimpacting less than a quarter of page loads at this point.

MUSTAFA: So really,we're just talking about protecting the user.

ADRIENNE PORTERFELT: Yeah, and I think users have a right to knowthat their information isn't secure when they'regoing to this website and help them make adecision about whether or not they want to keep using thatservice or go to another one.

MUSTAFA: And do youthink users are quite savvy now to see those things? Or is this part of theeducation for the user as well to say, look,there are certain things on the web which arenot secure that you have to take into consideration.

ADRIENNE PORTERFELT: I'll be honest.

We have literally billions ofactive users, so it's hard to-- MUSTAFA: Make ageneral [INAUDIBLE] ADRIENNE PORTERFELT: --say generally whether people are goingto understand it or not.

We think enoughpeople understand it that they have a reactionand that they can reach out to sites saying, hey, Ireally like this site, but I wish it were secure.

And we see people doing thatas we've been rolling out these warnings.

SPEAKER 1: The way thatcellular networks are set up is that there's alwaysthese fringe areas, and there's alwaysthese breakdowns.

And higher latencyis always there.